In Holland any gay with a sick note was out the door.

Homosexuality: it isn’t natural | spiked
24 Jun 2008 … Ignore those researchers who claim to have discovered a ‘gay gene’, says Peter Tatchell: gay desire is not genetically determined. …

A GLF perspective perhaps and the Dutch version..

‘Zelden rust-Noordanus stated “homo sexuality does not exist”, meaning there was no separate homo- or heterosexual identity’

http://www2.fmg.uva.nl/gl/radsex.html

That was both serious and completely accepted.

By homosexuals (without a sense of nullifying irony).

Gregory

Doh! Ever read any Judith Butler?

Also it is not gay rights who come up with crap about brains being hardwired, it’s evo psychs. And bad science.

An example would be a gay bar whose patrons are not friendly to the expression of heterosexual relationships therein. How do they create a place for the bisexual woman with a male partner? Is this possible?

This woman has NEVER been to Vanilla!

But WTF should gay bars create spaces for bi women with male partners? They can go everywhere else in the flipping country. So they can go and try to pull lesbians for threesomes?

PLUS it’s now illegal to have gay bars anyway.

Most intersex people do NOT experience a problem with their gender. And most are straight or gay.

Plus, sexual orientation is NOT chosen.

You don’t know what you are missing.

There is something terribly noble and radical about dutifully pottering about the kitchen, as hubby fights the good fight.

On the other hand there is definitely a constituency within feminism, which at times, has been a little critical of the barefoot and pregnant wing of hubby-posi-feminism (HPF)

Gregory

Yes. This.

But yes, *certain* radical feminists (not those here) do almost sound prudish, like the religious right, with their ‘thou shalt nots’.

And yes – political lesbianism is… bizarre.

Being sexually and romantically attracted to the oppressor class – it is hard. It really is. There are so few men who have *any* idea about feminism. I would rather be single forever and OMG DIE. AND BE EATEN BY MY CATS than settle for a crappy relationship with a slob who expects me to wash his clothes, cook his meals, and clean the home and gives nothing in return.

But – ‘I don’t think I’ll bother with men, I’ll be a lesbian instead’ is not the answer.

I mean, I so *would* be a lesbian if I…was a lesbian.

And I write as a lesbian who was recently castigated at length for *reducing lesbianism to genital sexuality* no less.

Like here for example

http://www.feminist-reprise.org/wpblog/2009/05/thoughts-pure-and-impure/

Personally I’d rather spend my time with my straight female friends than someone who is pretending to be a *lesbian* because they think it’s cool any day of the week.

“Maybe, just maybe, the reason straight ’sex positive’ feminists get so defensive about liking penis, and feel they need to stress it so much, is because everyone’s always telling them they must be *lesbians* or at the very least *queer* to be true radical feminists?”

I am not a “sex positive” feminist (and am generally reallllly irritated by the whole “sex pos” thing- as if all other feminists are anti-sex? Um, no) but I can very much relate to this statement. I don’t feel any need to go around talking about my sex life, in general, but it gets old fast listening to this crap.

I have heard this a LOT- that I am not a real radical feminist because I live with a guy and (gasp!) sometimes even have teh sex with him. I’m “in denial” or I “just don’t get it” or I “will someday see the error of my ways” and on and on and on. It gets old. According to these people, if I was a good little radical feminist I would dump the boyfriend and “choose” to be with a woman. And if I don’t, I’m just lying to myself and dontcha know all men are rapists and would rape you if they had the chance.

Bleh.